Post: #1

Hey guys,

I read a lot about dienone-products and the depression users get from e.g. L2K.
But i still don´t understand how this depression emerges. Is it because of high dienone-sensitivity? Or a build-up over a few days because someone doesn´t wash off the mone properly? Or just OD?

And are there useful strategies against that? I read about (7Keto)DHEA, some Alpha products (which?), Pregnenolone (don´t want to take this) and TAA (difficult to get here).
Any ideas?

Good night,
V

Post: #2

I have no pertinent insight into the mysterious depression issue.. but I have to say here that Pregnenolone, at least taken sublingually is AMAZING. I have been taking it on and off for two years at a low dose and can only recommend it. Nice, natural mood booster with no noticeable come down (for me). And as a side note.. I have used dienone at the same time as Pregnenolone and it didn't leave me depressed.

Post: #3

I get Androstadienone lethargy where I completely don't give a shit about anything, don't feel like doing anything, and don't feel like talking to anyone.

Many users have reported that it gets worse the more you use Androstadienone . Therefore I try to use it sparingly.

Post: #4

I GOT DEPRESSION ALL THE TIME AND AM NOW (2 WEEKS ) FREE FROM IT THOUGH I USE HEAVY Androstadienone 3-4X WEEK.

My secret.. Overdose. Half pump did the trick. It primes my balls for heavy Androstadienone products which follow later in the night.

Post: #5

(08-24-2014 12:56 PM)gounot Wrote:  I have no pertinent insight into the mysterious depression issue.. but I have to say here that Pregnenolone, at least taken sublingually is AMAZING. I have been taking it on and off for two years at a low dose and can only recommend it. Nice, natural mood booster with no noticeable come down (for me). And as a side note.. I have used dienone at the same time as Pregnenolone and it didn't leave me depressed.

Ok, did some research on it. Isn´t as bad as I thought.
So you took it when you took your dienone? Or the day after? Can you be a bit more detailed please? Like dosage etc.

(08-24-2014 1:09 PM)metaltree Wrote:  I get Androstadienone lethargy where I completely don't give a shit about anything, don't feel like doing anything, and don't feel like talking to anyone.

Many users have reported that it gets worse the more you use Androstadienone . Therefore I try to use it sparingly.

(08-24-2014 1:21 PM)dsouza Wrote:  I GOT DEPRESSION ALL THE TIME AND AM NOW (2 WEEKS ) FREE FROM IT THOUGH I USE HEAVY Androstadienone 3-4X WEEK.

My secret.. Overdose. Half pump did the trick. It primes my balls for heavy Androstadienone products which follow later in the night.

So at the end, the solution is a) to not overdo it or b) getting used to it?

Post: #6

(08-24-2014 1:21 PM)dsouza Wrote:  I GOT DEPRESSION ALL THE TIME AND AM NOW (2 WEEKS ) FREE FROM IT THOUGH I USE HEAVY Androstadienone 3-4X WEEK.

My secret.. Overdose. Half pump did the trick. It primes my balls for heavy Androstadienone products which follow later in the night.


So at the end, the solution is a) to not overdo it or b) getting used to it?

Just saying OD primes my balls and increases my natural test levels from low normal to probably mid way.. I notice this as I'm more driven, horny and even get more acne sometimes. In the end I have yet to experience Androstadienone depression in 2 weeks of regular use of heavy Androstadienone products like 2-3 sprays AM.

Before even 1 spray of taboo causes Androstadienone depression after a while.

Moderate Androstadienone doses not on consecutive days and having normal to high test levels will do the trick.

Garry from LAL once told me Androstadienone depression is a sign of low normal test in a man. I am 44. So I am on androgel now..

I agree with Garry OD is not for pussies its for getting pussy.. It will man you up the more you use it.

Post: #7

(08-24-2014 3:58 PM)Vincent_Vega Wrote:  Ok, did some research on it. Isn´t as bad as I thought.
So you took it when you took your dienone? Or the day after? Can you be a bit more detailed please? Like dosage etc.

(08-24-2014 1:09 PM)metaltree Wrote:  I get Androstadienone lethargy where I completely don't give a shit about anything, don't feel like doing anything, and don't feel like talking to anyone.

Many users have reported that it gets worse the more you use Androstadienone . Therefore I try to use it sparingly.

(08-24-2014 1:21 PM)dsouza Wrote:  I GOT DEPRESSION ALL THE TIME AND AM NOW (2 WEEKS ) FREE FROM IT THOUGH I USE HEAVY Androstadienone 3-4X WEEK.

My secret.. Overdose. Half pump did the trick. It primes my balls for heavy Androstadienone products which follow later in the night.

So at the end, the solution is a) to not overdo it or b) getting used to it?

Again.. I wasn't taking it with the Androstadienone in mind. Just happened to be co-administered at times. I took a 10mg lozenge, cut it in half and let it dissolve under my tongue after my morning workout and the other half at around tea time.

Feels blissful and natural. If it can be a remedy against Androstadienone depression has to be tested by someone who is prone to it.

As a side note.. I assume (lay opinion) that Androstadienone is a testosterone metabolite excreted by the skin. So I could imagine there's a negative feedback with testosterone and the luteinizing hormone. Meaning: Body detects loads of Androstadienone, lowers own production of man juice --> you feel like shit.

This is me speculating.. if anyone can put forward something substantial, i'd be interested.

Post: #8

Has there been any research or user discoveries/theories about why androstadienone causes this depression, and what the mechanism is? I've read that some people that already have depression don't get the dienone depression, while some with depression already, do get the dienone depression. Same for those without depression pre-dienone also. What the hell is going on?! lol

Post: #9

(08-24-2014 6:42 PM)gounot Wrote:  

(08-24-2014 3:58 PM)Vincent_Vega Wrote:  Ok, did some research on it. Isn´t as bad as I thought.
So you took it when you took your dienone? Or the day after? Can you be a bit more detailed please? Like dosage etc.

(08-24-2014 1:09 PM)metaltree Wrote:  I get Androstadienone lethargy where I completely don't give a shit about anything, don't feel like doing anything, and don't feel like talking to anyone.

Many users have reported that it gets worse the more you use Androstadienone . Therefore I try to use it sparingly.

(08-24-2014 1:21 PM)dsouza Wrote:  I GOT DEPRESSION ALL THE TIME AND AM NOW (2 WEEKS ) FREE FROM IT THOUGH I USE HEAVY Androstadienone 3-4X WEEK.

My secret.. Overdose. Half pump did the trick. It primes my balls for heavy Androstadienone products which follow later in the night.

So at the end, the solution is a) to not overdo it or b) getting used to it?

Again.. I wasn't taking it with the Androstadienone in mind. Just happened to be co-administered at times. I took a 10mg lozenge, cut it in half and let it dissolve under my tongue after my morning workout and the other half at around tea time.

Feels blissful and natural. If it can be a remedy against Androstadienone depression has to be tested by someone who is prone to it.

As a side note.. I assume (lay opinion) that Androstadienone is a testosterone metabolite excreted by the skin. So I could imagine there's a negative feedback with testosterone and the luteinizing hormone. Meaning: Body detects loads of Androstadienone, lowers own production of man juice --> you feel like shit.

This is me speculating.. if anyone can put forward something substantial, i'd be interested.

Thanks for your detailed response. Did some research and here in Germany, there is no Preg sublingual being sold. Oral and transdermal Preg seems to be quite useless.
I will maybe order some Preg sublingual from the UK.
Till then, any other suggestions?

(08-25-2014 11:21 AM)tdctdc Wrote:  Has there been any research or user discoveries/theories about why androstadienone causes this depression, and what the mechanism is? I've read that some people that already have depression don't get the dienone depression, while some with depression already, do get the dienone depression. Same for those without depression pre-dienone also. What the hell is going on?! lol

That's what i'm trying to find out ;)

Post: #10

(08-25-2014 11:21 AM)tdctdc Wrote:  Has there been any research or user discoveries/theories about why androstadienone causes this depression, and what the mechanism is? What the hell is going on?! lol

I have a hunch Androstadienone is a part of a negative feedback loop of the testosterone cycle in males.
Some even report a form of depression similar to low test levels in males. Me included in those reports. I feel very drained and tired after overuse of Androstadienone .

Androstadienone is a metabolite of testosterone and thus and end product of test utilization by the body. Waste product.

It makes sense that natural accumulation of these byproducts would trigger an innate "auto" regulation signal to "turn off" test production. If test is the precursor and Androstadienone is the waste, then its kinda like an overload failsafe valve. When the body reaches a critical level of these waste products it senses that it is time to regulate.

The body constantly strives for balance. We are adding Androstadienone artificially in larger doses than it is produced naturally so supports that we would reap larger feedback signals than normal.
Maybe the body senses a 30mcg app of Androstadienone and is like "oh shit oh shit shit I have to dial all this testosterone back some..."

Constant Androstadienone use when it begins to affect you:
The more you teach your body to sense this feedback signal the more it seems to become more efficient at reducing testosterone and thus enhancing the depressive effects.

I also have a hunch that the conversion of Androstadienone by body bacteria is part of this cycle as well. As the Androstadienone is consumed by bacteria it goes through a chemical change in which it becomes the bacterial metabolite androstenone.

I read once somewhere that males produce alot of Androstadienone during sleep. Perhaps the utilization of test for growth and repair creates more Androstadienone waste?
Either way it is well known that male testosterone levels are on average higher in the morning hours.

This leads me to speculate that certain olfactory mechanisms may be part of our natural hormone regulation system. The male produces more Androstadienone in sleep. Conversion to Androstenone. Does Androstenone upregulate male testosterone? We are working on that one, but early guess says yes.

I like to go a bit primal when looking into what things do.
Man works hard all day produces lots of test. Comes home at night tired. Eats, makes love to his woman, and rests. Gets up the next day and does it all over again.

There is a hormonal cycle behind the above and we as a community may have stumbled onto a part of olfactory hormone regulation not recognized by mainstream science. You mean to tell me that we as humans live in symbiosis with the bacteria that occupy our bodies?
Digestive research has already shown that we live in symbiosis with bacterial flora in our guts. That is how we digest fiber, lactose and even receive certain vitamins. It would be foolish to think we are not in the same symbiosis with the bacteria on our skin. I would bet my next paycheck that future antibiotics are alive. But now Im off topic.

All this is broscience and I can only make shots in the dark and educated guesses. These are just a mix of observations and experiences. Some guys get Androstadienone depression and some guys can wear 60mcg everyday with no issues. Other than a natural buffer of sorts I have no idea why this happens. Receptor sensitivity I assume.

We know mones work but alot of people do not think so. Therefore to the public our work here is instantly discredited and we are grouped into some novel area in their minds. Im good with that. More for us.