Post: #1

I would like to share my experience with a very interesting (yet ultimately disappointing) compound I have tested.

5,16-androstadien-3beta-hydroxy-17-cyano (AD3bOL17C≡N)


In a nutshell, this compound is structurally similar to Molecule “B” or Androstadienone, and a yet unexplored class of compounds with strong electronegative groups at C-17. It is best compared to, well, nothing out there.. It’s a radical new one, but it's effects are unlike any other compound that exerts effects by odor - classical pheromone effect.

So I mixed it in solution at 1000 PPM ethanol (50 mcg / drop), with magnetic stirring, and left it in the lab refrigerator for 3 days. Tonight, I have taken a few whiffs of the solution, and was rather ... starstruck? I cannot compare it to any pheromone that I have ever come across. Here is a detailed observation of results:

1st pass: fast whiff – strong ‘pheromone like’ smell, yet the odor seemed somehow synthetic and slightly dank. Dark and mysterious odor. The first effect I noticed was visual – lights seemed more vivid, and details of objects were magnified. Slight mood elevation, followed by slight anxiety (perhaps a natural reaction to something unknown and completely unexplored).

2nd pass: wafted odor towards nose for 2 seconds. Immediately noticed a massive increase in visual acuity. Details seemed many times more crisp and clear – as if my visual circuits suddenly became stimulated, and suddenly processed many times the usual quantity of visual data.

Details were observed with laser-like precision. Light sources intensified, and a 20 watt florescent light bulb appeared very bright – almost like looking at the North Star through the lens of a powerful telescope.

The visual effects are quite amazing. The best thing I can compare it to, for lack of a better comparison: those of you who have experienced MDMA, may know of the massive increase in visual clarity and perception of details which is felt just before the effects come on. Very powerful compound in this way, and by way of odor alone!

Other effects noticed were more moderate mood elevation, which quickly tapered off to an anxiety effect, with a generally uneasy feeling: I wanted it to go away – It is more dysphoric (unpleasant) overall than euphoric (pleasant). I also felt the potential for this compound to cause headache, as I felt as if I was on the verge of having one, and still feel a slight pressure in my head.

Effects on women unknown.

I am not sure yet if this will be released into the molecule testing project – even if it is included, I do not believe this compound will ever be sold or provided by Alpha Dream (it is powerfully unbalanced and not useful), but it may be interesting to observe and document the effects, for the purpose of advancement of pheromone technology and development of literature for future Structure Activity Relationship considerations.

If it is among those tested it will be for advanced testers only, with the understanding that the solution will not contact the skin (applied to garments only).

While this compound will probably never make it into any pheromone product, it does show us that compounds with strongly electronegative groups at c-16, or c-17 have predominantly visual effects. Other compounds with this characteristic will be explored in the future, and hopefully they will have effects which can be more in line with a useful pheromone product : )

Interestingly enough, androstatrione more or less falls into this class of compounds, and it has been reported to have ‘beautifying’ effects… Interesting, indeed…

Post: #2

Very cool, functional analysis can be rewarding!

Post: #3

Could it have attractive qualities or effects on women in doses below an amount that negatively affects your mood? Or below an amount that gives such strong visual effects?

Post: #4

For those like me who didn't get what c-16 or c-17 is, there is more info on steroid structures but the pic should do:



I've never tried any of these but a few thoughts on what I have been reading.. Androtics' Instant Shine is supposed to be TAA-heavy and seem awful similar to what Chris describes here. (followup retrieved through wayback machine )

The brightness of lights and headaches seem similar.

Our XPX also reported similar visual acuity with DHEA here, but this molecule is fairly different I think.

Androstadione is the one that gives some users heavy depression right? In this post dbot said it is more like increasing emotional access, so maybe this one could go either positive or negative?

Maybe if you put a cyano on 16 or 17 of androstatrione it would boost the beautifying effects? How much more electronegative is the cyano group than the ketones? I don't really get the chemistry but I try haha... =)

Post: #5

(01-09-2012 7:04 AM)chypre Wrote:  Androstadione is the one that gives some users heavy depression right? In this post dbot said it is more like increasing emotional access, so maybe this one could go either positive or negative?

What i got from high doses of DIY Pregnenolone was an intensification of emotions. Well-being, depressed, sexual attraction, getting carried away, everything felt more intense.

Maybe 5,16-androstadien-3beta-hydroxy-17-cyano also is an intensifier-'mone. Probably it lifts your mood in other settings.

Post: #6

Needs to be tested at much lower concentration.

Post: #7

(01-09-2012 11:08 AM)dbot Wrote:  Needs to be tested at much lower concentration.

True... I'll dilute it down to 1 mcg / drop and see what happens

Post: #8

Is the cyanide group a relative unusual group in streraloids? (for the uninitiated, cyanide is cyano group is carbon triple bonded to Nitrogen -C≡N)

Post: #9

(01-09-2012 12:07 PM)2Soon2Care Wrote:  Is the cyanide group a relative unusual group in streraloids? (for the uninitiated, cyanide is cyano group is carbon triple bonded to Nitrogen -C≡N)

Yes, the cyanide group is not usually found in steroids.. The cyanide group is a pseudo halogen however, it is slightly less electronegative than a bromo or chloro group, and about on par with an iodide group with a smaller valence shell : D

The ultimate electronegative group would be 17-trifluoromethyl, and I would be scared shitless of that one based upon my experience here...

don't worry.. The cyanide group discussed here, when it's part of a molecule in this way, is not like the poison hydrogen cyanide ; p

Post: #10

Hey 2soon, I think you might find it interesting that the estratetraenol analogue of this compound is documented to have potent antiproliferative effects on cellular tissue. Im not sure if it acts on a cellular receptor, or is a ligand to Cytosine (which would be my guess).

Strange, I would have expected the opposite... Just goes to show how unpredictable the relationship between biology and chemistry can be sometimes.

Dbot, you have some of this at 1 mcg/ drop on the way soon.