Post: #1

Hi guys!

Past few months I found out that I was having thinning hair. And then today I took a picture of my head and I think I am really balding. I don't know if it has got to do with the pheromone usage but the rate I am losing my hair is quite bad.
I am somehow suspecting a teeny bit of it has got to do with the mones.

Mones aside, anyone fighting MPB can give me advice on what to do?
A quick search through the Internet gives me stuffs like Propecia(Finasteride) or Minoxidil (Rogaine). However, I am trying to find a more natural solution rather than taking these pills.

Oh yeah if it matters, I am a 22 year old Asian.

Post: #2

Sorry to hear about your hair loss problems. unfortunately there's not much you can do about it except for a hair transplant, taking propecia (be aware of the side effects though) and rogain (again, side effects)

The good news though is that are lots of new technologies on the horizon in the testing phase right now and are waiting for FDA approval.

Look up the company Histogen, Replicel and Anderans...they are all in Phase I and II of testing and should be out on the market within 2 - 5 years. IF they pan out then it will be the closes thing to a cure

Post: #3

Say no to propecia.

Propecia has been connected to loss of libido and to impotence. These side effects do not dissipate when the medication is halted.

Link says permanent...




It is possible that mones are connected. Your natural hormone balance has changed.

Post: #4

Hair thinning/MPB could be an indicator of rising levels of DHT. I hear progesterone can help block the effects of DHT but, I would suggest you get your bloodwork done to check your hormones before you listen to the advice of strangers on the internet.

Post: #5

Btw Arrowtotheknee, i forgot to mention, go to your local drug store and buy some Nizoral shampoo. Studies show that is inhibits DHT in the scalp. DHT is the main cause of hair loss. You can get nizoral in the %1 or %2 form (depending on what country you live in) But don't use the shampoo more than twice a week as it's a very strong medicine. Its active medical ingredient is ketoconazole and too much can cause liver problems because your body absorbs what you put on it... and it could make your hair very dry and brittle if you use too much. Nizoral can MAYBE slow down your hair loss until something better comes along.

I agree with paradigm... go to propeciahelp.com and you'll think twice about propecia. But that's your choice. I know propecia works for some people but at what cost.

Post: #6

Hey Arrow,

Sorry to hear about your current dilemma. I too am a fellow Asian (age 40) engaged in the battle of the receding hairline for going on 8 years now. Trust me, if you THINK you're losing hair, you very likely ARE. Don't bother asking your hairstylist if she thinks you're losing up top; for some reason it's like one of the 10 Commandments of hairstyling to lie when asked about this. "Thou shalt not tell your client his hair is thinning." If you start seeing more hair in the shower drain, that's all you need to know.

In the beginning, I tried all the creams, pills, lotions and hair formulas that I could research and find on Google. I read all the "review" sites, the vast majority of which were and still are to this day, glorified money extracting landing pages. Trolled the most popular forums as well. I've never touched the more pharmaceutical solutions (Rogaine, Propecia, etc.), because I'm not too crazy about potential unintended side effects. Also, the vast majority of druglike solutions fail to address MPB in the frontal crown region, which is where I'm battling.

There are literally hundreds of "solutions." And it is an endless maze. And my takeaway from this 8 year fight is quite simply "old tricks are the best tricks." Without further ado:

1)Polysorbate 80. I know, you, like most guys battling hairloss are like "Polysorbate what?" Without going into details, read this: I use this every day, prior to showering. I just apply the oil onto my scalp and let it soak in for 10 minutes before shampooing it out. Totally eliminates the itchy, inflammation type of feeling in your scalp and hair. The first time you use it, you realize how clean and light your hair feels after washing it out. Polysorbate 80 is used in all kinds of things, even ice cream. Despite this, there are sites devoted to throwing this product under the bus. This product has been on the market since the the 80's, and yet very few people have heard of it. Luckily, there is a nat'l retailer that's been carrying this product for eons: Vitamin World. You can grab a bottle on their website for like $8. Super cheap, and lasts a long time. For a product like this to have survived for decades underneath the radar should tell you something.
2)Emu Oil. Closest thing to a miracle product that I've ever tried, and mainly NOT due to it's hair promoting abilities. The ultimate sore muscle, achy joint pain reliever that I've ever tried. And no menthol stink, no greasiness, etc. As a hairloss product, emu oil is one of the very few substances that seems to aid in frontal crown regrowth, which is what I'm all about. Unfortunately, emu oil is NOT cheap, it's something like $300-500 per gallon. Not that you'd be buying it by the gallon, but you get the point. Luckily, there is a emu product sold at national retail locations (Kroger, CVS, Rite Aid, etc) that is marketed as a pain reliever: Blue Emu. In addition to emu oil, it contains other pro hair substances that just also happen to double as pain relievers, like MSM. I'm paying like $15 for about a months supply. In addition to knocking out my sore knees for up to 12 hours at a time, I use it in my thinning areas up top. And I believe it's been working. Just as a pre and post workout muscle and joint pain reliever alone, it's worth it's weight in gold. Truly incredible product, man.
3)MSM. Good old fashioned MSM. Been around for ages. I first bought this 15 years ago to combat springtime allergies, for which it has been effective. But one of it's "side effects" is that it strengthens and accelerates hair growth, unfortunately not just up top, but all over. 1000 mg every four hours is good. Very non-toxic; you could use tons of it if you're into diminishing returns and flushing your money down the toilet for no reason.
4)Biotin. 5000 mg, once a day.
5)Krill Oil. 1000-2000 mg a day.
6)Beta Sitosterol. To combat DHT, lower bad cholesterol and keep prostate problems at bay (DHT related).

This is my CORE. As new treatments and possible solutions arise, I look into them, but #1-6 remains a constant for me. I think right now, ecklonia cava (aka Seanol) is the latest flash in the pan. I tried it and wasn't impressed. If you buy online, I would suggest iherb.com as your main one stop shop; they seemingly have everything (minus the Polysorbate 80 product that I refer to and Blue Emu, though they have tons of pure emu oil products; you can go that route too), and they're pricing is practically the best I've seen on the net. They ship fast.

Listen, I'm no doctor, and I make no medical claims. All I can do is tell you, based on the last 8 years of relentless pursuit what I've found that works the best for me. Like I said, I've tried all kinds of pills, creams, lotions, herbals, heck I've even used a laser comb and this is what has stood the test of time when the dust finally settled.

Two websites I wish had discovered earlier:

Check the My Current Regimen tab.

Check the Updated/News tab.

If I could go back in time 8 years, these are the products I would tell myself to use right from the beginning. I believe it would've made a big difference.

Post: #7

Hey Dafixisin,

Cool suggestions there. A few I hadn't heard of and will try myself, like the emu oil. Incidentally, beta-sitosterol doesn't seem to help with enlarged prostate. Even though it blocks the conversion of Testosterone -> DHT it doesn't seem to penetrate the prostate. There was a recent fairly large study on the topic.

OP:
As for things to help with hair loss naturally... the best low-side effect way to deal with hair loss is to raise SHBG. Do this by reducing calorie intake relative to nutrient intake (like with green veggie juicing or eating lots of green vegetables), aerobic exercise and cutting down on your fat and calorie intake. As the Japanese got access to better nutrition and more calories their size (height and weight) increased and their hair loss also increased.

SHBG binds to T so it's not floating free unless you need it so it's less likely to be converted to DHT. All the benefits of Testosterone, none of the nasty hair loss. Stress can also lower SHBG. (and hair loss causes stress. How's that for a viscious cycle?)

Post: #8

Thanks for the input guys!

I have decided to follow some of dafixisin advice. Has gotten myself some Emu Oil off Iherb.
I have already been taking Biotin and MSM through this supplement called Maxi-Hair so 3/4 should be covered.
As for Krill oil, I have been taking fish oil (around 3000-4000mg daily). I hope that is good enough.

Have also dropped by one of the pharmacy near my house to get the Nizoral shampoo.
Will be cycling this shampoo with the Avalon Biotin Shampoo from Iherb which I had gotten last month.

Will stick to this regime for now.

Post: #9

An old thread, and i dont know if you still stick around at forum anymore. But heres my saying in this matter.

Before you go an and thinking about healing this, its always a good idea to figure out why this is happening to you. In this way, it is so much easier to understand what to do.
For instance, is baldnes something that runs trough your family? Dont only look at your father, you could just as well gotten it from your mothers side. So have a look at the male relatives belonging to your mother. It can also be minor issues from both sides making the mix from your parent blush extra on you. If that is so, the case for you is that the baldnes will sooner or later come for you as well. And your job is to both accept it will happen but also make shure it happen later than sooner. In that case following Dafixisin's advice is a good idea. It will be important to make shure your skin doesnt get effected by allergies or other skin disorders.
You most also make shure to get the right supplement. I see you want to take Krill oil. Fish oil will give you Omega 3 and also Omega 6 and E vitamins. That alone is not good enough. Its not a bad thing taking fish oil, but your hair growth are in need of vitamin B most of all, but also vitamin A, Vitamin C, Zinc and Magnesium.

However, if baldnes is something that you shouldnt get trough you family, then something else is wrong with you. And you should deffently go see your doctor for a test. It can be anything from wrong diets to messed up hormone production. Dont let your doctor ignore your issue. Maybe its not a big issue for him, but its a big issue for you.

The suggestion of hair implants for a person who's young as only 22 is really not a good idea. At this age the hairloss have just started. Making implants on the spots thats lost now will not make the hair loss stop. So already after a year or two this will look very weird when the hairloss have continued around the implant spot. Usually the hairclinics only recomend hairtransplant for persons above 30 who have bu then finished their balding.

Post: #10

(10-08-2012 8:48 AM)Arrowtotheknee Wrote:  Hi guys!

Past few months I found out that I was having thinning hair. And then today I took a picture of my head and I think I am really balding. I don't know if it has got to do with the pheromone usage but the rate I am losing my hair is quite bad.
I am somehow suspecting a teeny bit of it has got to do with the mones.

Mones aside, anyone fighting MPB can give me advice on what to do?
A quick search through the Internet gives me stuffs like Propecia(Finasteride) or Minoxidil (Rogaine). However, I am trying to find a more natural solution rather than taking these pills.

Oh yeah if it matters, I am a 22 year old Asian.

well, this is a post from awhile ago, but I'll add a late reply as well.

Did you use alot of Androsterone (androsterone, alpha or beta)?
If you look at how it works, androsterone will convert to DHT with a single metabolic step, and vice versa, DHT will convert to Androsterone with a different single metabolic step. DHT in the hair folicles doesn't come from your blood, or anywhere else in your body, it is created in your hair follicle cells. Epiandrosterone is essentially androsterone. One is an a isomer and the other is a b isomer. They will BOTH convert via steroidal enzymes 3b-HSD and 17b-HSD into DHT as the target hormone. So the only way to get it there is to have Androsterone "AND" 3b or 17b-HSD in your hair cells.

http://pherotruth.com/Thread-Epiandrosterone

from wikipedia, not that they are always right, just big

Quote:DHT aka Dihydrotestosterone aka 5α-Dihydrotestosterone, CAS# 521-18-6
DHT is the primary contributing factor in male pattern baldness.
Prostate growth and differentiation are highly dependent on sex steroid hormones, particularly DHT.
[Image: 220px-]
DHT is converted to 3α-Androstanediol and 3β-Androstanediol.
(5α-Androstane-3α,17β-diol CAS# 1852-53-5) is an androstanediol derived from DHT in a reaction catalyzed by the enzyme 3-α-HSD.
(3β-Androstanediol CAS# 521-18-6) is an androstanediol derived from DHT in a reaction catalyzed by the enzyme 3-β-HSD.

Quote:13-cis-Retinoic acid competitively inhibits 3View the MathML source-hydroxysteroid oxidation by retinol dehydrogenase RoDH-4: a mechanism for its anti-androgenic effects in sebaceous glands?
Teresa Karlssona,
Anders Vahlquista,
Natalia Kedishvilib,
Hans Törmäa, Corresponding author contact information, E-mail the corresponding author
a Department of Medical Sciences/Dermatology and Venereology, University Hospital, Uppsala, Sweden
b Division of Molecular Biology and Biochemistry, University of Missouri, Kansas City, MO, USA

My thoughts on it are complex. I worry about puttinng Androsterone on my hair, because my younger brother already lost all his. But I've used alot of Androsterone so far and grown some extra hair as a result. No results are verified but I think that using Androsterone on wrists & neck actually has a hair growth effect. I could also be crazy. I've thought about this alot over the past year though, and wanted to tell my friends who are losing their hair to apply Androsterone on their wrists daily and see if their hair grows back, but at the same time, I don't want to be liable if the rest of their hair falls out, so nobody has tested this yet.

But, if the 3a or 17b-HSD is the bottleneck of the process, perhaps having more Androsterone in your system thru transdermal exposure with mones will cause the HSD to get used up in your wrists or neck, and not have the availble HSD left over to convert exogenous Androsterone (made by you) in your scalp into DHT in your scalp. Because you used up all your HSD in your wrists.

what do you think of this?